Margaret: I’m so excited to have this conversation because your books The Fire, The Water and Maudie McGinn just won the 2024 ALA Schneider Family Book Award for outstanding representation of the disability experience. I think all of your work does a great job of representing the disability experience. Why is that important to you?
Sally: Margaret, I really appreciate your kind words. I’m so glad we had this conversation. I’ve always felt that we’re similar writers, with similar interests.
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In a way, I make it my mission to include as many nuanced neurodiverse characters in children’s literature as possible, because those characters didn’t exist when I was a child and struggling to understand how to interact with the world. I felt like I was from another planet. I would have given anything to “meet” a character going through the same thing, someone who could potentially guide me. I read voraciously, but I never saw my struggles (let alone potential solutions) depicted. It was like I didn’t exist.
It was the same when my autistic/neurodevelopmental children were little. There were nice books overall, of course. But very few that were truly respectful and honest representations of the disability experience. Back then, characters with disabilities were just symbolic nods, autistic characters were comedic stereotypes, and disability was often used as “inspiration porn” or as a blunt, pathologizing example (“This is my brother X_. He has Y_. Here’s a list of his symptoms”). That made me want to throw open the windows and shine any kind of light on honest, authentic, natural representation. I wanted kids today to have characters they could love, respect, enjoy, admire, learn from, and look up to. Characters in natural story adventures who just happened to be different.
What about you? What made you become so interested in disability representation, both in your work and in general?
Margaret: Sadly, I started thinking about disability representation when my oldest son was diagnosed with epilepsy, then a learning disability, and later autism. With each diagnosis, I learned anew how able-bodied and able-satisfied our culture is. You’re right, it’s hard to find positive disability representation. But it’s easy to encounter ableist representation. I recently saw a movie called Theater Camp. The movie starts with a woman being incapacitated by photosensitive seizures and falling into a coma. And that scene is played for laughs. My daughter has photosensitive seizures. It’s not funny to us, and it’s ableist.
In short, my journey is different than yours, but we got to the same place. I decided to include characters with disabilities because I wanted my daughter to see her experiences represented. I wanted her to know that she has strengths and is not alone. I also wanted to highlight that the challenges people with disabilities face are often socially constructed. I teach college students, many of whom identify as neurodiverse. They face many barriers, including noisy, crowded classrooms that tax their sensitive sensory systems and are highly distracting. Investing in such classrooms is a choice our society makes about whose strengths we prioritize.
But no more preaching from me! My fellow writer, Sally. Please explain how you do the opposite of what I just did. How do you stay on mission without sounding pedantic?
Sally: When I start writing a story, I don’t overtly and consciously think about addressing a specific representation. It just develops from the story problem and the character’s personality. I have a very diverse network of neurodiverse family and friends, so that’s my knowledge…I’m not sure I could write a neurotypical character with that much depth; it would feel like “writing the other.” (By the way, https://writingtheother.com/ is a great resource for learning how to step back and write respectfully from your own experiences.)
Another thing that helps me is that even though I may look old and rattled on the outside, I still feel very young on the inside. I feel very connected to my inner 12-year-old. I’ve heard that at the age when something significant happens, a part of us remains stunted. And maybe that’s true. I’ve also heard that children’s authors write to heal their inner child, to rewrite parts of their childhood.
Is this true in any way for you, Margaret?
Margaret: It’s a new idea for me, but one I can relate to. My parents divorced when I was 10. I went from being middle class to receiving free school meals and living in low-income housing. And now my latest book, Sunny Parker is Here To Stay, is about a girl who lives in low-income housing. She’s a far cry from me, but I related to her feelings of shame, especially about owning clothes from the thrift store. I vividly remember a white sweater with gold buttons that my mother bought me from the thrift store, terrified that my peers would say that it had once been theirs.
What about you? Does your latest work connect you to your childhood?
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Sally: Yes, absolutely. So much of my heart, soul, and life experiences are in Maudie. And in my new book, Invisible Isabel (out July 9th), in the acknowledgements I thank my grade school bully for inspiring parts of the story. Haha. So yeah, I put parts of my life and my heart onto the pages, but for healing, for young readers, and maybe for myself too.
We’ve spoken privately about the hardships we’ve each experienced. Disabilities certainly complicate childhood. In closing, I’d like to say that the people I know who have experienced real adversity in their lives are some of the most interesting, intelligent, polished, compassionate, and lovely people I know. It’s like kintsugi: shattered into pieces and repaired with gold. Or, as the brilliant autistic author Matt Haig said, “A chipped teacup is fine; it’s one with a story.”
Margaret: Sounds good. Cheers to a teacup full of chips!
Sally: Cheers to stories and the positive impact they can have on the world.
Author Profile:
Margaret Finnegan is the author of the Junior Library Guild selection Sunny Parker is Here to Stay (JLG Gold Standard), New Kids & Underdogs, Susie B. Won’t Back Down, and We Could be Heroes, all published by Athenaeum Books for Young Readers. Her work has appeared in FamilyFun, the Los Angeles Times, Salon, and other publications. She lives in Pasadena, California, and enjoys spending time with her family, walking her finicky dog, and baking delicious chocolate cakes. You can find her at MargaretFinnegan.com or on Instagram at @FinneganBegin.
Photo by Stephanie Sandell
Sally J. Pla is the author of THE FIRE, THE WATER, AND MAUDIE McGINN, winner of the 2024 ALA Schneider Award, THE SOMEDAY BIRDS, winner of the Dolly Gray Award, and several other novels and picture books. Her books have received starred reviews and have appeared on many state award lists and “best book” roundups. Sally, who has a neurodevelopmental disability, has appeared on television and radio as an author and autism advocate. She also runs the website resource “A Novel Mind” (anovelmind.com). Sally believes in kindness, respect, and the beauty of different brains. We are all stars that shine differently! Her website is www.sallyjpla.com.
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